Considering a Tracer

[Sunde]

8 hours ago, knyte said:

More bells and whistles equate to what, exactly?  Safety?? While ppl fiddle with menu wheels that tend to fall apart, for unnecessary features?  Squint at displays that are too small?  No thanks.

What, exactly, makes newer models, as you insist, "safer"?  It's still subjective.

Do you know or understand how cornering ABS/TC function?
Your arguing the same way people were back when ABS was introduced to bikes.
"I dont ride fast enough to need it"
"im skilled enough"
"I ride safe"
Hillarious logic, but still present to this day in some riders.
These systems are not MEANT to be activly used, they are in the background taking care of you if suddenly you hit a bit of loose pavement whilst you are trailbraking or on the gas out of a corner.

It is again indisputable that the T9 is a safer motorcycle. The rider aiding technology is better. And no matter how hard you try you will not be able to make a convincing argument for anything other than this fact. 

"More bells and whistles equate to what, exactly?  Safety??"
Just wow lol the IMU is not what i would consider a gimmicky feature, its really good technology. Thats why ALL modern high'er end bikes come with these equipped.
If you manage to kill yourself because you are fiddeling with the switch gear (no idea why you'd do that whilst moving) You set the bike up how you like and then dont ever touch the switch gear again lol.
But IF you manage this, its simpel natural selection. The fact that you point out the addition of a menu system as a hardzard is just very meh... 

"What, exactly, makes newer models, as you insist, "safer"?" It's still subjective.
I cannot be bothered to find more facepalm gifs, but i would insert one around here.
No its not fking (excuse me) subjective, its absolutely unequivocally not subjective haha. 
It is in fact 100% factually true that the T9 has better safety systems, thus i will continue to insist that by definition it is a safer motorcycle. 

Edited August 6, 2022 by Sunde

[kilo3]

Cripes sakes did you design the T9 from the ground up or something? It's a motorcycle, not your first born child. Relax before you give yourself a brain aneurysm.

[knyte]

18 hours ago, Sunde said:

thus i will continue to insist that by definition it is a safer motorcycle. 

Which is your: 

Subjective
Opinion

I am very well aware of what the technology offers, it just doesn't excite me.  It so happens I don't own something with that many assists, and I'm happy with what I have - don't need anything more (so far).  The value is there for me.  I didn't say I was more skilled than necessary - in reality, the opposite is true - I can't wait for my next bike course.  Training, skill, and experience is far more important to me than a lean angle sensor, or even ABS.

I can sum it up  for you simple terms:  a decently trained & skilled rider will rarely, if ever, reach the limits of the assists, emergency or otherwise.  I get that it's supposed to be for a dire situation, but good strategizing & training will keep you out of said situations.  Full Stop.  Feel free to insert your favourite facepalm gif here, I don't mind.

By your logic, how has anyone with a class 6 survived until today?  They should all be pancakes and telephone pole stains.  Geeze, my uncle toured the US perimeter - twice - and most of Mexico - on a Honda 750 4 - made it home every time.  My dad toured New Zealand on a Honda in the 70's.  No ABS then, either.  Carbureted, no less.

I find this line of reasoning, but more so the tone, beyond pedantic, and outright patronizing.  This is an argument already lost, because you're trying to reason with that which is clearly only important to you - not necessarily the person actually shopping for a bike.  It's up to the RIDER to make the informed decision on what model, generation, and ergonomics is a good fit for them.

So, with that, I wish you good day, sir!

[Sunde]

7 hours ago, kilo3 said:

Cripes sakes did you design the T9 from the ground up or something? It's a motorcycle, not your first born child. Relax before you give yourself a brain aneurysm.

Did someone hurt your fweelins? 
Sorry dude, hope you get over it. 
Way to go getting a snarky comment in, happy to have your contribution to the discussion (not) maybe just dont bother commenting next time.

[Sunde]

7 hours ago, knyte said:

Which is your: 

Subjective
Opinion

I am very well aware of what the technology offers, it just doesn't excite me.  It so happens I don't own something with that many assists, and I'm happy with what I have - don't need anything more (so far).  The value is there for me.  I didn't say I was more skilled than necessary - in reality, the opposite is true - I can't wait for my next bike course.  Training, skill, and experience is far more important to me than a lean angle sensor, or even ABS.

I can sum it up  for you simple terms:  a decently trained & skilled rider will rarely, if ever, reach the limits of the assists, emergency or otherwise.  I get that it's supposed to be for a dire situation, but good strategizing & training will keep you out of said situations.  Full Stop.  Feel free to insert your favourite facepalm gif here, I don't mind.

By your logic, how has anyone with a class 6 survived until today?  They should all be pancakes and telephone pole stains.  Geeze, my uncle toured the US perimeter - twice - and most of Mexico - on a Honda 750 4 - made it home every time.  My dad toured New Zealand on a Honda in the 70's.  No ABS then, either.  Carbureted, no less.

I find this line of reasoning, but more so the tone, beyond pedantic, and outright patronizing.  This is an argument already lost, because you're trying to reason with that which is clearly only important to you - not necessarily the person actually shopping for a bike.  It's up to the RIDER to make the informed decision on what model, generation, and ergonomics is a good fit for them.

So, with that, I wish you good day, sir!

I cant, just cant
am very ready to end this, we agree on that. 
And for the record i apologize if you feel patonized, not my intention. 

Suggest a mod locks the thread before others like Kilo3 gets too excited, dont think thats what OP was after.
Good day to you too. 

Edited August 7, 2022 by Sunde

[Ride365]

1 hour ago, Sunde said:

I cant, just cant
am very ready to end this, we agree on that. 
And for the record i apologize if you feel patonized, not my intention. 

Suggest a mod locks the thread before others like Kilo3 gets too excited, dont think thats what OP was after.
Good day to you too. 

Threads shouldn't be locked down when people disagree, too much of that occurs everywhere online these days and it needs to stop. However when a person/persons feel they need to win an argument or topic of conversation, then yeah that can get outright annoying.  

[Larry1096]

For what it's worth, as the OP I appreciate all the varying viewpoints. 

 

Larry

[Sunde]

2 hours ago, Ride365 said:

Threads shouldn't be locked down when people disagree, too much of that occurs everywhere online these days and it needs to stop. However when a person/persons feel they need to win an argument or topic of conversation, then yeah that can get outright annoying.  

Fine by me, i think Knyte made i quite clear that he was done bickering, and thats simply what i am doing.
 Its not a matter of winning (maybe it is for some) its just a matter of people being VERY black and white in their comments which i felt like OP did not deserve when he has asked what boils down to a pretty complex question. 
If you think your comment or comments like Kilo3 is what OP is after (or the one i have just written as a response to yours) thats fine, i dont moderate the forum. I just find this very dull.
 

[Sunde]

48 minutes ago, Larry1096 said:

For what it's worth, as the OP I appreciate all the varying viewpoints. 

 

Larry

Glad to hear it, dont get scared off posting or commenting in other threads just because this specific thread turned so argumentative by the way. 
Hope you land yourself a good deal on a Tracer at some point!
 

Edited August 7, 2022 by Sunde

[kilo3]

4 hours ago, Ride365 said:

However when a person/persons feel they need to win an argument or topic of conversation, then yeah that can get outright annoying.  

I seriously thought that Sund dude was going to pop a vein. I can't even care enough to unblock him to read.

[Sunde]

41 minutes ago, kilo3 said:

I seriously thought that Sund dude was going to pop a vein. I can't even care enough to unblock him to read.

Cant even imagine how it must feel to throw in a small insult on a motocycle forum only to block the person you'v insulted immediately. 😅 Real powermove right there.

I'll try to get over it
Oh wait, wait a second

I think i just did? 

❤️

Edited August 7, 2022 by Sunde

[peteinpa]

OK. I can tell you what I think, you can tell me what you think.

You can't tell me what to think. It's that simple.

This isn't the correct section to get so arguemntive.  Chill.

 

[OZVFR]

All good now, stocked up on popcorn so please go on 😁

I for one think that the more safety features the better, I also think that a bike with all the bells and whistles will be a safer bike than one without regardless of your riding skills. 

Using an argument about an uncle who rode around WooWoop in the 60’s and made it back alive is ludicrous. 

So is arguing about using adaptive cruise control while lane filtering will make it brake all the time. FFS, nobody can save someone from their own stupidity. 

The right tool for the right job. 

I very rarely use motorways, but would love adaptive cruise in that situation. 

Cornering ABS, yes please, all these things are great for that one time you get caught unawares, or lose concentration for a second, or conditions change without you realising it. It does not matter if you’re a pro or novice. 

Also at the end, it’s a personal choice, but today’s bikes are definitely safer than the old shitboxes we had in the 80’s. 

[Ride365]

Just good/proper brakes and suspension alone makes any bike safer......for me all the electronic gizmos and nanny control is unnecessary and perhaps even more dangerous in some cases.

[1moreroad]

6 hours ago, OZVFR said:

So is arguing about using adaptive cruise control while lane filtering will make it brake all the time.

Can't believe I'm jumping into this, but...

I'm legit curious, does moto ACC not trigger while lane splitting/filtering? Or are you saying that we, as experienced riders, shouldn't even be using ACC or CC while splitting/filtering?

Just curious if the electronics are so sensitive to tell the difference.