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Stability inquiry: 2015-17 (FJ09) vs 2019 (Tracer 900)


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New 2019 Tracer 900 owner here! Just wanted to ask if the stability/steering wobble at high speeds was addressed by the improvements on the 2019 model? The 2019 model has been updated with a longer swing arm at 59.1" whereas the 15-17 models were only 56.7".

I've done a bit of research and there were quite a number of instances where the FJ09s had that 'death wobble' issue at higher speeds. Would like to know if a steering damper is still necessary aside from the usual suspension adjustment catered to my weight. Thanks!

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Not a death wobble by any means... Yamaha has a slight rear weight bias on it's motorcycles which leads to a "slightly light feeling" at the front end at triple digit speeds and it's nimbleness... This feeling can be amplified if one rides with death grip on the handle bars, some believe it's the handguards...

Can be solved by raising the forks approx 10-15mm above triple tree... 

Edited by norcal616
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2015 fj-09- Graves Exhaust w/Woolich tune by 2WDW @120whp
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1 hour ago, ozn3 said:

I've done a bit of research and there were quite a number of instances where the FJ09s had that 'death wobble' issue at higher speeds. Would like to know if a steering damper is still necessary aside from the usual suspension adjustment catered to my weight. Thanks!

I think a steering damper is an expensive Band-Aid fix to mask a lack of suspension setup.  My buddy and I have '15 FJ's and both bikes have after market suspension.  We have swapped bikes many times and neither bike has a high speed wobble.

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***2015 Candy Red FJ-09***

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IMHO no additional hardware is needed. The "problem" is due to poorly adjusted suspension and the rider holding on too tight.

I have seen many claim on this board that they are not holding on too tight, but I would have to disagree.  It is simply a definition of what too tight is.

I recently completed a trip to the UK from Sweden via Denmark, Germany and Holland.  Those nice Germans have provided kilometre after kilometre of high speed test track in the form of Autobahns.  I took the opportunity to experiment at speeds up to and exceeding 200 km/h, that's 125 mph in old money.

I could at will order up a smooth wobble free ride or a wobble depending on how I held onto the bars. For info I had Yamaha's semi-rigid Euro panniers fitted and a Givi 40 litre topbox.

The trick to a wobble free ride is to grip the right bar sufficiently to hold the throttle in position, but no more. Your left hand should have en extremely light grip on the bar. Your fingers are simply wrapped around the bar but not really gripping it.  Your upper body is held in position by your stomach/abdomenal muscles and NOT your arms.  

At higher speeds there is turbulence on our bikes. Whether we realise it or not this turbulence on our arms and upper body is constantly providing small steering inputs to the bars. It is these that induce the wobble.  I'm willing to bet that most people experiencing a wobble are holding themselves in position on their bikes with their arms and not their upper body.  The arms being battered by the wind make small steering inputs and create a wobble.

CS 

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It's a Death Machine. The self-proclaimed experienced riders say it tried to kill them and sold it.

FJ-09 is only a 51/49 weight bias stock naked. But, combine poor aeros, mediocre and severely undersprung suspension, short wheelbase, and notorious overpacking and it's going to feel much less stable than many bikes.

Most I've experienced is a slight wobble when the front end gets light in turbulent air, passing a semi at high speed for example. Nothing I wouldn't ride right through. Have raised forks in the triples, have upgraded suspension. Didn't like the handguards anyway so they came off early. Not buying a damper. Still love the bike and it's a keeper but it's not for everybody. It hasn't killed me yet :)

Edited by chitown
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It is pretty common for high performance sport and race bikes to be equipped with a steering damper.

So why not the FJ or GT?  What's the big deal here?

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8 minutes ago, nhchris said:

It is pretty common for high performance sport and race bikes to be equipped with a steering damper.

So why not the FJ or GT?  What's the big deal here?

Its more than likely the aggressive frame geometry/steering angle.  The steeper the steering angle the quicker/twitchier the steering. 

***2015 Candy Red FJ-09***

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Thank you for your inputs! It's very illuminating and I suppose there's no better way to find than to just ride the damn thing haha!

Basing from the stuff you've shared, I'll ride the bike with the stock suspension setup first where everything is in the middle and work my way from there. For reference I'm only 5'6" at about 175lbs so just a little higher than the average Japanese male the suspension was supposedly setup for. I'm coming from a 2017 Suzuki SV650 with a little over than a year's worth of riding experience on a bike so I really don't plan to ride hard right off the bat until such time I'm more acquainted with the Tracer. 

I'm guessing the longer wheelbase will keep things planted as well so I'm hoping for the best. 

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Try these settings...I'm 180# suited up...the settings are near bottom of page... My forks are raised approx 12mm

 

Edited by norcal616
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2015 fj-09- Graves Exhaust w/Woolich tune by 2WDW @120whp
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On 6/27/2019 at 1:05 AM, betoney said:

I think a steering damper is an expensive Band-Aid fix to mask a lack of suspension setup.  My buddy and I have '15 FJ's and both bikes have after market suspension.  We have swapped bikes many times and neither bike has a high speed wobble.

I completely agree with this. I have a 2017 with K-Tech on both ends which I did at around 500 miles. Not a hint of head shake and in fact I love riding this on the highways as much as the back roads. It just handles and handles.

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On 6/27/2019 at 1:23 AM, captainscarlet said:

.....The trick to a wobble free ride is to grip the right bar sufficiently to hold the throttle in position, but no more. Your left hand should have en extremely light grip on the bar. Your fingers are simply wrapped around the bar but not really gripping it.  Your upper body is held in position by y

our stomach/abdomenal muscles and NOT your arms.  

At higher speeds there is turbulence on our bikes. Whether we realise it or not this turbulence on our arms and upper body is constantly providing small steering inputs to the bars. It is these that induce the wobble.  I'm willing to bet that most people experiencing a wobble are holding themselves in position on their bikes with their arms and not their upper body.  The arms being battered by the wind make small steering inputs and create a wobble.

CS 

Agree 100%, having ridden my Dyna naked with apes at triple digits( that's some wind drama) you really have to use your abs and hold your feet just right on the pegs so your arms aren't affecting the steering head. Riding my GT at triple digits into a head wind and passing semis there's some wind drama as well, a lot easier to deal with though because the Yamaha's ergos are setup so you can use your knees to grip the body of the bike, a lot easier to me

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On 6/28/2019 at 12:05 PM, norcal616 said:

Try these settings...I'm 180# suited up...the settings are near bottom of page... My forks are raised approx 12mm

 

I'll give this a go and ride around with it. I'm also having a hard time keeping my foot down at times (already dropped my 2-day old bike but thank goodness that I installed crash bars already) so I need to lessen the preload at the rear and a bit on the front. From factory, so I just turn the front preload until the exposed part is 6 lines are showing and just one click towards soft at the rear? I won't mess with rebound at this point in time first. 

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Yes 6 lines showing...

Low speed ( under 25mph) use the rear brake more than the front brake... yes I use the front brake to help provide most of the stopping power w/rear brake from speed till under 25mph, then I stop using the front brake and use the rear brake... This frees up your throttle hand at low speeds to provide throttle inputs...

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2015 fz-07- Hordpower Edition-80whp
2015 fj-09- Graves Exhaust w/Woolich tune by 2WDW @120whp
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Newbie member and first post. Don't laugh too hard!

I was having wobble issues on my '17 FJ (got bike at the end of last summer). Was only happening at high speeds that I rarely see so I wasn't to worried about it, and it was more of an issue on rough pavement and/or in strong, gusty wind conditions. However, after swapping stock tires for Shinko 705s with much more aggressive tread pattern, wobble would set in at speeds as low as 75 mph under right conditions.  Not acceptable needless to say. Did some research and decided to try raising forks first, based on other riders experiences with this issue. I raised forks 1/10" at a time and went for test rides. I have now raised forks .5" and wobble tendency is non existent below 115 mph, and when it sets in it is a much more gradual and milder version. I will likely lower forks another 1/10-2/10" and see what effect it has. A pleasant surprise and bonus was how much better cornering and and handling is, as well as stability in general. I still have much to do with suspension, which i am sure will improve things further.

I have noticed a couple other factors in all of this. For the heck of it I increased rear shock preload from 4 to 5 and and it reduced the speed at which wobble came on by 20 mph. I have set rear shock preload to 3 now, and is much better again. That seems to support the theory that this bikes rear end is too rigid right out of the crate. Sitting up and back helps as well, while leaning forward when wobble would start setting in would aggravate the situation. The harder i accelerate, the lower the speed it would happen at well, which makes sense.

As mentioned, I have much playing around to do with suspension yet, but ok with where things are for the time being. My tires are only speed rated to 130 mph in any case and rarely go north of 80-90 mph.

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I have about 200 miles on my 2015 (the bike has 2900 miles on it) and no stability issues at all. I read this thread before buying it yesterday so i was a bit nervous about getting it on the highway. But I've had it close to 100 MPH with no issues. I rode for many miles at 80/85 MPH. 

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