Advice Needed - Low idle/stalling

[angrygirafe]

Ran out of time today before I got to figure out the connector. I can’t tell if I got the lock all the way released. It popped out a little, but I was hesitant to see if it would go further. I’ll try and fashion a custom paper clip and watch some videos at work tomorrow (hooray desk job) to see if I can get those pins pushed back. 
 

Really hoping the ECU didn’t get shorted. It looks like the male pin it got pushed against doesn’t get connected to a wire (the female plug has a silicon plug in that pin) but no idea if that male pin is connected to anything in the ecu. 

[skipperT]

Paper clip won’t do it. And although peteinpa’s info is helpful this connector is a combo job...

I tore my bike apart last night and mangled my connector (for the sake of this forum lol...). BTW each ECM connector is different in the way they come apart.

I’ve attached some photos but they may not provide all the clarity you need.

This pic shows the 2 tabs on the LH and RH side (shorter) of the connector.  These are what need to be released to get the cap off. All I did was tackle it from the shorter side with a flat blade and gently twist the screwdriver on one side, and then the other until both tabs were released and it popped off.

This shot shows those tabs again circled in Red.

Circled in Yellow is the problem child. The white piece is the locking tab. In the photo below it must be pried UPWARDS away from the connector to unlock the pins.

However, the housing is in the way! So if you look carefully at this last picture, I am holding a smaller flat blade screwdriver pointing at one of the 4 slots in the sides of the connector.  In each one is a tab that must be disengaged, and then the connector slides DOWNWARD into itself, which would then expose the white locking piece and allow it to be removed and unclipped, thereby allowing the pins to be completely removed.

Mine is partially moved in the pic below. I had one that was being stubborn and I gouged the crap out of the plastic trying to get it to release before I stopped and said, yeah no more... as my bike is (theoretically) fine.

 

Angrygiraffe, if it were me - I'd pop that black cap off, and then you can at least expose the terminals that you may need to repair. I was able to successfully move (somehow, I'm not sure exactly how I did it) some of those female receptacles UPWARD and out of the connector housing WITHOUT removing the locking piece which stops the receptacles from moving DOWNWARD and exiting the connector. So you could attempt the repairs you need to perform hopefully without mangling the housing.

YMMV and all that stuff.

Oh and @peteinpa why? because I tore mine apart to check the valve clearances again and thought to myself as I removed the ECM - Oh heck why not, I'm curious as to how this is assembled...

-Skip

Edited March 18, 2021 by skipperT

[peteinpa]

You mangled your perfectly good connector?! Why?😣😟

 

[angrygirafe]

Omg you guys, it lives! So, I’ve had a bit of a hiatus. Starting to get warm here in Phoenix, and there was some landscaping and attic electrical work I needed to get done before that kind of activity becomes fatal. 
 

This afternoon I got back to it. I didn’t remove the suspicious pin from the plug, but I did unplug and replug the YCCT Servo. Key on. NO ERROR?!?  Fired it up, and it caught! The idle is a little low, but not bad. The gas in the tank is now 5 months old and the airbox is off, so maybe that’s it. Gonna put it back together, and if it still works, a test ride is in order 🙂

 

 

[angrygirafe]

Whelp. I made it 3/4 of a mile before the engine died, light came on, and fault 60 was displayed. 
 

Fortunately it’s a little hazy, so only 92 degrees pushing it home. Cold shower time. 
 

I’m convinced it’s a loose connection on that YCCT sensor circuit. Or I should say “more convinced”, since Skipper basically narrowed it down to that already. I’m guessing a shorted ECU would not let me get out of the neighborhood and up to 4th gear before remembering it’s broken. Will pull apart the ECU connector next. After a beer. Or two. 

Edited April 11, 2021 by angrygirafe

[angrygirafe]

So it was only 85 when I got up this morning, and decided to take a crack at this. I was very excited to find a damaged pin and replace it. Imagine my dismay when the pin appeared to be perfect. Getting the black collar off that connector was a nightmare, so I was able to shove it through like @skipperT. Unfortunately, it just doesn't look like it's the problem. I did push down on the little punched in tab to get a better connection, just in case. But my dash still throws the Code 60, and Diag still shows 60/0, 61/0, 62/1. If y'all think it's worth replacing (and can clue me in on the pin size, molex I'm guessing), I'll put a new one on. Otherwise, I think I'm down to a problem with the ECU, or it is a legitimate problem with the YCC-T. Lame.

[skipperT]

Oh boy... it’s been a bit, and I had to rescan this thread somewhat. 

so ECM pin fit: you mentioned that you adjusted it - I’d double check to make sure that the “drag” on that female receptacle is close or the same tightness or “drag” as the surrounding ones that were undamaged. Make sure the bent pin is sitting pretty along with the others. 

you mentioned before that the problem seemed to repair itself after you were messing with the TPS and APS sensor connectors. I would examine those pins in the sensor side for any being bent, and also the female connector side check those for tightness and “drag” similar to the ECM connectors. Check the YCC-Motor 2p connector for same. 

go back to the service manual tests for voltage and continuity. Verify everything is reassembled correctly. Charge the battery. Check for blown fuses again. Something is still amiss or newly amiss here. 

sorry that all I have from the armchair...

-Skip 

[angrygirafe]

10 hours ago, skipperT said:

Oh boy... it’s been a bit, and I had to rescan this thread somewhat. 

so ECM pin fit: you mentioned that you adjusted it - I’d double check to make sure that the “drag” on that female receptacle is close or the same tightness or “drag” as the surrounding ones that were undamaged. Make sure the bent pin is sitting pretty along with the others. 

you mentioned before that the problem seemed to repair itself after you were messing with the TPS and APS sensor connectors. I would examine those pins in the sensor side for any being bent, and also the female connector side check those for tightness and “drag” similar to the ECM connectors. Check the YCC-Motor 2p connector for same. 

go back to the service manual tests for voltage and continuity. Verify everything is reassembled correctly. Charge the battery. Check for blown fuses again. Something is still amiss or newly amiss here. 

sorry that all I have from the armchair...

-Skip 

Thanks Skip, your help has been more valuable than I can say. I feel bad about not chasing things down more promptly, but unfortunately our summers are brutal for working outside or in the garage; 112 currently. I might have a couple cooler days this week I can trace things out, but it’s looking more like I’ll be surrendering it to a shop at this point. 
 

That beer (or bottle) is still on me if you find yourself in Phoenix someday

[duhs10]

5 hours ago, angrygirafe said:

Thanks Skip, your help has been more valuable than I can say. I feel bad about not chasing things down more promptly, but unfortunately our summers are brutal for working outside or in the garage; 112 currently. I might have a couple cooler days this week I can trace things out, but it’s looking more like I’ll be surrendering it to a shop at this point. 
 

That beer (or bottle) is still on me if you find yourself in Phoenix someday

You gotta let us know what you or they find once it is finally resolved.

[angrygirafe]

20 hours ago, duhs10 said:

You gotta let us know what you or they find once it is finally resolved.

Will do. I’m hoping for a cool morning to take one more crack at it before rolling the dice with a shop. I’ll definitely update with anything found though. 

[angrygirafe]

Was browsing through docsimples old error thread today and wondered, did I actually reset the code correctly? Tried it after work, and it cleared. Fired it up and let it run for 5 minutes, no problems. I just keyed it on again after a couple hours and still no error code. 
 

So. 
 

I’m going to bust out the calipers, measure that molex pin, and swap it. And if everything still works, I’ll risk a short test ride, hopefully this weekend. Don’t want to go far though, because it’ll be 113F, and that’s warmer than I’d like to push the bike home. 
 

Sure would like to put some fresh gas in though. 

[angrygirafe]

I've learned through trial and error (ordering from Amazon), that despite the similar appearance, the pins are NOT Metri Pack. And if I'd done more googling, I probably could've skipped that step. 

I have learned that they are likely JAE-MX23A pins, and I can get what looks like the whole 33-pin connector from various Asian countries. Domestically, I can get JAE-MX23A pins, or different even numbered connectors. 

 

Ordering from Alibaba makes me nervous for my identity, but the crappy pictures on Cycle Terminal make me unsure of the product. Currently debating which route to risk...

 

 

 

Edited July 29, 2021 by angrygirafe

[skipperT]

12 hours ago, angrygirafe said:

I've learned through trial and error (ordering from Amazon), that despite the similar appearance, the pins are NOT Metri Pack. And if I'd done more googling, I probably could've skipped that step. 

I have learned that they are likely JAE-MX23A pins, and I can get what looks like the whole 33-pin connector from various Asian countries. Domestically, I can get JAE-MX23A pins, or different even numbered connectors. 

 

Ordering from Alibaba makes me nervous for my identity, but the crappy pictures on Cycle Terminal make me unsure of the product. Currently debating which route to risk...

 

 

 

I’d be nervous about ordering the one from your upper photo too. As you noted the picture doesn’t match, and I know for a fact that Yamaha Roadstars use a different (simpler!) ECM connector.

the pins in the connector on the other hand, not sure if they would work. 

glad you were able to clear code and ride with no light on!

what’s the connector supply place that’s always being linked up in various threads here? Maybe they have them?

I’ll check around today and see if I can find any more info about that connector. 

-Skip

[angrygirafe]

3 hours ago, skipperT said:

I’d be nervous about ordering the one from your upper photo too. As you noted the picture doesn’t match, and I know for a fact that Yamaha Roadstars use a different (simpler!) ECM connector.

the pins in the connector on the other hand, not sure if they would work. 

glad you were able to clear code and ride with no light on!

what’s the connector supply place that’s always being linked up in various threads here? Maybe they have them?

I’ll check around today and see if I can find any more info about that connector. 

-Skip

I think CyclTerminal is the common place for Japanese bike connectors. Now I’m wondering if the Sumitomo connector (the correct one) uses JAE MX32A pins. Cycleterminal does list a Sumitomo Honda 33-pin connector that looks awfully similar to the Yamaha. And I can order the Sumitomo pins and crimp tool individually from there. Might give that a shot. 

[angrygirafe]

Long overdue update time, tl;dr: NO ERROR CODES AND IT RUNS. Mostly.

 

So it's been a while. A looooong while. Such a long while, that my Brother in Law actually had possession of the bike for the last few months. He used to ride, he was getting back into, and bought an S1000R that scared him to death. He's more mechanically minded than me, so I told him he could HAVE the FJ, and it was up to him to get it running.

 

So he did. 

 

I had bought an ECU and Wiring harness from a wrecked bike and just had them sitting in the garage. He replaced the ECU connector with the one off the wreck and most of the time the fault code went away. He did some hunting, and replaced the FUSE HOLDER as well, as apparently the contacts had enough play after so much poking around that the ETV fuse would lose continuity and throw the error. 

 

So. NO MORE FAULT YAAAAAAAAY!!!!!!!!!!

 

And then he went nuts modifying the few things I hadn't! Slipper/Assist clutch with a billet basket, Lightech chain adjusters, FJR footpegs. And he replaced the airbox, getting one from a wreck, and it ended up coming with a high performance filter.

 

The reason for the airbox is because now he was back to my initial problem. The Idle. Sometimes it's fine. Sometimes it hangs high, like 2.5-3k, and then drops low, like 800. Most of the time it drops low. So he replaced the airbox, went over the vac system and found THREE MORE BROKEN VAC CAPS. Rebalanced the throttle bodies. Checked the clutch switch. Tried the other ECU. No luck.

 

Fast forward to a couple weeks ago. I started a new work rotation, 50 mile commute round trip, mostly freeway. That is JUST inside the range of the Zero riding a little slower than I prefer (still around 80mph). I have Level 2 chargers at work, and installed one at home. So I'd charge at work in the morning, and charge at home overnight. But the Zero is not made for high(ish) speed, long(ish) distance commutes followed by charging. Mornings weren't bad, since it's the coolest part of the day (haha, 90F right now), but evenings were rough. About 110F-115F rough. So sometimes I'd have to wait an hour in the morning before the Zero was cool enough to charge. But I was waiting SIX HOURS to charge at night, and throttled the charging down to 3.3kW instead of 6kW. Kind of a pain.

 

So I started looking for a new FJ-09. When I told my BIL about it, he said he didn't really need the FJ anymore, and was riding the S1000R more. Awesome!

 

I took a bus out there (Southern California) last weekend, and rode the bike back same day, 330 miles. I had some idling issues when filling up the first couple times, and was running Techron additive in the tank. And NO issues on the freeway. I think I did 95-105mph most of the way home and it just purred. No idling issues by the time I got home. But the last week of commuting shows there's still the idle issue. 

 

It's weird, because 30ish percent of the time it's fine, and it's always fine when cold. Most of the rest of the time it goes low. Occasionally it goes high and then always drops low. Sometimes it stalls. If I crack the throttle just a little bit it's rock steady at 1200rpm. 

 

I have a service manual now, and there's not much for idling. I've checked the the ISC code (01: check intake system) and reset it. Other suggestions are valve clearance/timing. I'm hesitant to do that since it was done by one shop and verified by another, but I may get there eventually. I've got some Ring-Free on the way to see if it's as magic as some forums say it is. Next I think I'll look at the fuel pump. Then probably valves.

 

So anyway, I'm back on the FJ and loving it, idle problems and all. It's just way more fun than the Zero. It also feels waaaaay better in corners, despite the lower CG and much higher quality suspension of the Zero. Go figure.