pattonme Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Why 6-8 turns? Many needles out there are like the brass one, about 4mm long and decent included angle of about 11-14deg. The Andreani is VERY shallow and 8mm long. Say we 'pre-set' the needle to 4 turns. After the cap is locked, backing out 4 turns leaves only a minute change in exposed area and another 4mm worth impinging into the hole. You need to back the needle out 9mm for it to be truly out of the way. Unfortunately the very shallow taper means if the setup isn't bang on, twirling the needle a full 4 turns does very little. For rebound this is less of an issue. For compression it's more likely to be an unnecessary limitation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docsimple Posted November 21, 2015 Author Share Posted November 21, 2015 C leg oil recommendation 11-14cSt@40 Golden Spectro Shock (ultra light) 2.5w Bel-Ray HVI Shock 3w Kayaba (K2-S shock) Silkolene Pro RSF 2.5w Maxima Racing Shock 3w R leg oil recommendation (pending) I bought Redline 2.5 wt. I hope this is good as it is now what I have in the garage 2015 Red FJ 09 2013 WR250R - little boy blue - sold 2012 DL650 V Strom - sold 2007 FZ6 - sold 1986 FJ600 - sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 that should be fine. Maybe you'll actually be able to use your C needle! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docsimple Posted November 21, 2015 Author Share Posted November 21, 2015 looking at your pics I'm fairly sure they were flush (ie. 4 turns in) when I did the install. Very easy way to check. turn the silver till it bottoms. If it ends up flush, then yes you have ~4 turns of range. If it keeps going deeper and deeper, well... Hopefully it'll bottom out before you hit 9+ turns. After that the o-ring no longer seals so you will likely have some oil trying to come up the center.4 turns on compression and 5 turns on rebound. Looking forward to testing the new settings tomorrow. I had stuff way out of line. 2015 Red FJ 09 2013 WR250R - little boy blue - sold 2012 DL650 V Strom - sold 2007 FZ6 - sold 1986 FJ600 - sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp1ros Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Quick question on adjusting the preload on these, does the turning of the golden nut eventually bottom out or top out or does it just keep on spinning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 it does not bottom out - it will run right off the end of the threads. Not likely to be a big deal since it's under pressure and *should* thread back on if you spin it CCW. Topping out though is a mechanical limit. The old style with the super long golden rod part (pre-july 2015) had a C-snap ring on the shaft so that there was a mechanical limit in both directions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp1ros Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 Thanks pattonme, i suppose this is why the manual instructs to set the preload from fully open to close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp1ros Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 I checked the preload and yes i can confirm that when turning counter clockwise it will eventually top out. When turning clockwise at some point it is running off the end of the threads but will thread back if you continue turning clockwise. Can someone please let me know what happens in terms of the rebound and compression adjusters? I have tried to follow the discussion on this thread and i am getting confused... I am no suspension expert. Is my understanding that if everything has been installed correctly - or as the manual instructs - , then the compression and rebound adjusters will bottom out in 4 turns from full counter clockwise ?? I had them installed and i am trying to make sure that they were done properly. It appears however that on both the compression and the rebound legs, if i start from full counter clockwise (the ajusters top out there) and turn clockwise it takes 4 turns for the adjusters to be flush with the gold preload nut, but they continue threading (i.e. do not bottom out). I did not continue all the way to find out how many turns it takes for them to bottom out. And one more thing - can someone confirm if fully closed = fully clockwise and fully open = fully counter clockwise? Many thanks in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docsimple Posted February 13, 2016 Author Share Posted February 13, 2016 sp1ros, pay careful attention to this post. This is where i screwed up. Everything after this post (bottom of page 1) is how to setup correctly. Preload is set by measuring sag with you onboard. Aim for 40-45mm. The directions didn't (used to) do a good job of calling it out, but you start by turning the needle all the way out (CCW), then turn it in say 4 turns (you might be able to get 5), THEN you install it on the shaft till it lightly bottoms out, chase the nut upward to the gold part, tighten and then thread cap into fork tube. If you didn't do that, your needles are probably completely non-functional since they are backed out too far to do any regulating. Given the design and valving choices Andreani made, start with Comp all the way out (CCW) and Reb 2 turns out from seated. First deal with rebound. You want it as fast as possible without oscillating. Tuning C is more a function of brake stability and test riding it over say washboard/rumble strips and/or hitting the odd non-severe pothole. 2015 Red FJ 09 2013 WR250R - little boy blue - sold 2012 DL650 V Strom - sold 2007 FZ6 - sold 1986 FJ600 - sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp1ros Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 Thanks docsimple. The installation is now done and i had it done at a shop. However, i was not impressed after the discussion i had with them and now i am trying to make sure all is ok. I have seen your posts, after you corrected your installation can you please tell me if the R and C adjusters bottom out properly to the number of turns you used to set the needles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pattonme Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 And one more thing - can someone confirm if fully closed = fully clockwise and fully open = fully counter clockwise? yes. And if you set your needles to 4 turns and then install the cap you will have 4 and ONLY 4 turns (modulo a little slop) between CW and CCW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp1ros Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 Excellent! Thanks pattonme. So my suspicions were correct... I will need to have a word with them since i can certainly go clockwise for considerably more than 4 turns from fully open on either the R or C legs. Adjusting the rebpund made no difference and in a nutshell they have not installed them correctly... I have to say, this forum is very active with alot of information on pretty much everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docsimple Posted February 13, 2016 Author Share Posted February 13, 2016 No problem, the credit certainly goes to pattonme though. When I started (setting them before setting the caps on the tubes) they were set as pattonme recommended on page one. This means the center part which connects with the needles was actually below the top when it was installed. I'm not sure they will completely bottom out (closed) but I believe they will. I am hesitant to mess with them as it took a while to dial them in as very small changes in the setting has a big affect. My understanding is they have much fewer turns than a standard clicker therefore any change is amplified. Thanks docsimple. The installation is now done and i had it done at a shop. However, i was not impressed after the discussion i had with them and now i am trying to make sure all is ok. I have seen your posts, after you corrected your installation can you please tell me if the R and C adjusters bottom out properly to the number of turns you used to set the needles? 2015 Red FJ 09 2013 WR250R - little boy blue - sold 2012 DL650 V Strom - sold 2007 FZ6 - sold 1986 FJ600 - sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp1ros Posted February 13, 2016 Share Posted February 13, 2016 I got worried when i was told that to set up the preload i had to remove the cap which sounded to me bonkers. Hence i started checking everything and through yours and pattonme's inputs i am getting to the bottom of this. But docsimple perhaps this needs to be clarified for other members as well. If we set up the depth of the needle properly, then after installation this should be the completely closed point and from there we can start adjusting. Hence it should bottom out pretty much. If i understod correctly, this is what pattonme getting at as well And one more thing - can someone confirm if fully closed = fully clockwise and fully open = fully counter clockwise? yes. And if you set your needles to 4 turns and then install the cap you will have 4 and ONLY 4 turns (modulo a little slop) between CW and CCW. . If i am wrong please do correct me!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp1ros Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 Just a follow up, i had the cartridges installed again today by a suspension specialist and now it feels great. It might be the placebo effect, so i shall ride a bit more and see. What i can say is that it sure is worth making sure that they are installed properly!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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