2bad Posted July 20, 2018 Share Posted July 20, 2018 With all the talk about cam chain tensioners over the last couple of years, I was convinced that I should swap mine out for an APE unit. The install went well but at the time I didn't notice any decrease in engine noise. Stupidly, I proceeded to tighten the APE more to see if the noise would decrease. Perhaps it made a slight difference, but at the time I didn't realize the consequences - with the APE pressing too hard against the tensioner blade, the nylon on the blade was wearing way too quickly. Over time I suspect it has worn way too much (all the clickety-clackity has returned) and the blade now must be replaced. The blade is held in place by a pivot pin. My question is, Can the blade be replaced simply by removing the pivot pin, sliding the old one out and then a new one in ? The Haynes manual describes the process in conjunction with removing the camshafts, but it is not clear if the camshafts need to be out in order to remove the tensioner blade. I would be willing to tackle the blade replacement if it is a simple job, but removing the camshafts scares me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skipperT Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 I hope for your sake that it’s the guide which is held in with a pin as shown in the photo Piotrek posted. This one might be accessible once the timing cover is removed. If not, replacement may require removing the head. Many times there is a “notch” on the guide which fits into a seat on the cylinder cavity. If that’s the case, the cyl head will have to come off, and you’ll need a head gasket and possibly the cyl bolts if they are one time use (torque to yield). It becomes a much bigger job. So yeah, the cams gotta come out regardless. -Skip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duhs10 Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 I hope for your sake that it’s the guide which is held in with a pin as shown in the photo Piotrek posted. This one might be accessible once the timing cover is removed. If not, replacement may require removing the head. Many times there is a “notch” on the guide which fits into a seat on the cylinder cavity. If that’s the case, the cyl head will have to come off, and you’ll need a head gasket and possibly the cyl bolts if they are one time use (torque to yield). It becomes a much bigger job. So yeah, the cams gotta come out regardless. -Skip Ouch... hope my APE is set ok. '15 FJ-09 w/ lots of extras... Fayetteville, GA, USA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buggy Nate Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 I would be very concerned with where the excess nylon particles have ended up. All that nylon could quite easily block the oil pick up. There was a case previously where someone had similarly overtightened the stock tensioner screw (on a fz-09 I believe) and destroyed the engine. Maybe pulling the sump and cleaning the pick up might be in order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Member 2and3cylinders Posted July 21, 2018 Premium Member Share Posted July 21, 2018 Yes, the slider can be replaced with the cover off and removing the pin. It takes some jiggling and the chain of course must be loose... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skipperT Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 Ouch... hope my APE is set ok. If you recall... OE tensioner spring force on the guide wasn't insignificant... it really wanted to come out, so unless the APE screw is cranked hard in there...should be no issues. IMO, the tensioner is in there to take up the slop and keep the chain on the sprockets, not necessarily to make things super quiet... that might be a misconception. Oh I totally agree. It’s just a matter of how Yamaha put the engine together. I’ve taken lots of motors apart where they get creative in making sure those guides are locked in to the innards of the motor in some way. Haven’t pulled down a CP3 yet beyond a simple cam removal for valve adjust. -S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skipperT Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 Ouch... hope my APE is set ok. If you recall... OE tensioner spring force on the guide wasn't insignificant... it really wanted to come out, so unless the APE screw is cranked hard in there...should be no issues. IMO, the tensioner is in there to take up the slop and keep the chain on the sprockets, not necessarily to make things super quiet... that might be a misconception. Oh I totally agree. It’s just a matter of how Yamaha put the engine together. I’ve taken lots of motors apart where they get creative in making sure those guides are locked in to the innards of the motor in some way. Haven’t pulled down a CP3 yet beyond a simple cam removal for valve adjust. -S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2bad Posted November 6, 2018 Author Share Posted November 6, 2018 By the way @2bad ... did you get yours fixed? Sorry to keep everyone waiting on the results. I have since traded in the bike, and my attention was diverted to other things, so I only now just realized I should give some kind of closure to this thread. So yes, I installed a new tensioner blade. The dealer had to wait a couple of weeks for the part to arrive, so that was frustrating. But it wasn't expensive (around $50 I think) and didn't take long to install. It was exactly as 2and3cylinders said, some wiggling around involved but easily doable. I zip tied the cam chain firmly to the crankshaft sprocket before removing the old one, as the chain becomes fairly limp and I didn't want to risk skipping a tooth. Put everything back together, re-install the APE tensioner and set it at 9 threads exposed, coincidentally just as Piotrek had mentioned above. The motor then sounded like what I remembered from before this issue, which was not the quietest in the world but nevertheless running smoothly. If I had moved forward with this bike I would have been prepared to listen to much more pronounced cam chain tensioner noise before adjusting the APE any tighter. Now if anybody is curious as to how tight it was, leading to this problem, the answer is 4 threads exposed. I should also mention that the old part was significantly worn. Sorry I din't take a photo. The irony of the whole situation is that I never needed an APE in the first place. I had been trying to deal with a long-standing vibration problem which had developed before the bike was a year old. It would usually show up between 2500 and 4000 rpm, and at times to me sounded and felt like a chain dragging against metal. Many people have complained about it. Those who have it know it, those who don't just don't understand it. After a lot of research going back several years now (fj and fz forums around the world) I concluded it is something to do with the clutch. That would have been my next target if I had kept the bike. But I had a bit of a sour taste by this time, so I traded it on a whim for something I had admired for a while, but which cost a fair amount more. Don't want to mention what, as it is not the issue here. I should mention that I traded the FJ in good conscience - I did an oil change as part of this procedure, and several oil changes had been done since the louder noise had begun. I rode it for hundreds of kilometres before the trade with no change in engine sound. I still felt there is plenty of life left in the motor, and we all know it has proven to be reliable, if not quiet. My thanks to everyone here for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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