Anatomy of a crash.....for the self-insured

[bwringer]

On 4/6/2022 at 4:30 PM, Brian said:

I guess my question is......will a motorcycle crash be likely to be caused by a distracted cager and my medical bills be covered by their insurance?

No, and only up to the limits of the cager's policy, which are usually laughably low ($25K is the limit here in Indiana). And that's if (BIG IF) said clue-free cager has a policy.  And they are 1,000% at fault and freely admit it.

Since you don't get to pick what sort of accident you might be in, let alone look for a nicer car to hit you to increase the odds of insurance... this is a terrible idea.

Plus, you have plenty of deer in TX, and they do not have insurance.

And you have assets -- you will NOT get a writeoff or discount from medical providers until you are literally penniless and in the street. And even then the collectors will find you under your cozy garbage bag behind the Walmart. And yes, they will go after you, not the person who injured you.

 

Your overall "plan" to skip health insurance just because you're cheap is an extremely bad plan. Don't do it.

Get a "Bronze" ACA plan through the exchange if you only want the absolute minimum. Pay attention to coverage if you travel to in other states; this is usually lacking. COBRA might start looking pretty attractive, honestly, once you start looking at what little crap is out there.

 

And yes, most motorcycle accidents happen through too much alcohol and/or too little skill ("too much speed" is a fairly meaningless catch-all). Assuming you eliminate these, and wear a real helmet and gear, you're still left with a significant amount of risk over piloting a minivan.

I'm trained, sober, skilled, licensed, geared-up, etc. and I've been in three injury serious motorcycle accidents. None had a damn thing to do with speed or skill, just bad luck:

1) Fresh hamburger grease spilled from a leaky truck. That was an odd one, but debris from trucks is a significant hazard to us all.

2) Left-turning triple-fake unlicensed phone poker. I'm pretty damn wily and hard to kill after all these years on two wheels, but this lady was a real brain-free zone and she got me.

3) Deer. You have deer in TX, and they're just as stupid and overpopulated as the deer in Indiana...

[Wintersdark]

21 hours ago, bwringer said:

 

1) Fresh hamburger grease spilled from a leaky truck. That was an odd one, but debris from trucks is a significant hazard to us all.

2) Left-turning triple-fake unlicensed phone poker. I'm pretty damn wily and hard to kill after all these years on two wheels, but this lady was a real brain-free zone and she got me.

3) Deer. You have deer in TX, and they're just as stupid and overpopulated as the deer in Indiana...

1. Holy crap, is that ever both wildly unique and also hilariously terrifying.  I mean, sure, you're absolutely right that stuff falling out of trucks is a very real danger... but hamburger grease?  Good lord.  Guy I worked with had a toilet fall out of a truck in front of him, ended up with it shattering across a wide area.  Got the larger part of the bowl lodged behind his front tire (didn't go down, but was unable to turn the front wheel; managed to pull over). 
2. Yeah, this right here is ultimately the common wildcard, the Really Distracted(or just incredibly stupid) Driver.  You learn to watch for them, but they're an everpresent danger
3. Deer are the single most simultaneously suicidal and murderous animals on the planet, IMHO.  Hard stop.

[2and3cylinders]

YEAH, WHAT ALL ABOVE SAID!

LIFE IS TOO SHORT AND FRAGILE TO PLAY RUSSIAN* ROULETTE WITH IT.  AND THERE ARE YOUR LOVED ONES TO THINK ABOUT, AND NOT ONLY FINANCIALLY BUT EQUALLY OR EVEN MORE IMPORTANT EMOTIONALLY IF YOU WERE HURT BAD AND DIDN'T GET THE CARE YOU NEEDED.

AND I'M SURE YOU KNOW HOW TO SPELL ASSUME.

*DAM PUTIN AND HIS CRONIES.

sorry for the CAPS...

[nhchris]

2and3 makes a good point above. And while we’re at it, do you have life insurance?

Cause if you are too injured to need health ins it would be nice for your family to be able to pay off the house and replace your income to age 66!

Not to be morbid or anything….  😉

Edited April 9, 2022 by nhchris

[wanderer]

In short, I also would recommend health insurance.

Of course, in principle insurance is statistically on average not worth it if you feel you can afford to self-fund the large negative outcome (hence the insurance companies make money).

However, in the US health insurance also tends to act as a health service and negotiator. Health providers will overcharge, the insurance companies negotiate it down. If you are self funding, the providers will overcharge you and you'll have a hell of a time negotiating it down on your own. Of course, if you are unable to pay the full amount, they may settle for only what you can pay (i.e. close to all your assets), like the 20-something year old pancreas anecdote. They may have asked for $2M, and perhaps would accept a $1M payment from insurance or whatever the uninsured patient can afford up to $2M.

Taking into account this negotiating aspect, I believe health insurance is worth it, even in the statistical average, in the US, for anyone with assets (20-something may get away without it - young, healthy, few assets, a lifetime left to build).

And as others have said, I certainly would not rely on the other driver being adequately insured. They may also just hit-&-run. Nor would I rely on myself not making one mistake at a really bad moment. Nor would I rely on nothing coming from out of the blue like a cancer or heart condition.

Actually, if considering retiring on some amount of assets you should even look in to umbrella insurance. So your assets are protected if anyone sues you for whatever.

 

[bwringer]

Right, health insurance pays as little as possible, but it does serve as sort of a club discount card.

Pricing for the uninsured is "whatever they feel like charging", and it's many times what is charged for insured.

Assuming you're in network, anyway. If you're out of network, then you're back to "whatever number they make up".

Oh, and guess what -- most ambulance providers are deliberately not part of any network, so they can charge whatever they feel like. Your insurance pays whatever they feel like (hint: not much) and your busted ass is on the hook for the rest.

I could go on, and on, and on some more, but I won't.

Edited April 10, 2022 by bwringer

[2and3cylinders]

10 hours ago, nhchris said:

2and3 makes a good point above. And while we’re at it, do you have life insurance?

Cause if you are too injured to need health ins it would be nice for your family to be able to pay off the house and replace your income to age 66!

Not to be morbid or anything….  😉

As I've mentioned before, SWMBO has my life insurance premium* payment on auto-deduct, and when I say good bye as I step out the door to head out for a ride, she'll sometimes say "Have a good ride and if you truly love me show it by making me a rich widow."!

*Which since I turned 65, doubled. 😣 Wish we were financially secure enough to not need it.