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nicksta43

Cam chain tensioner or something worse?

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This morning I pushed the bike out of the garage and started it up to let it warm a bit while I put my helmet and gloves on. It started fine and everything sounded normal. I mounted up and started walking it backwards out of my driveway and it started making a strange clackity sound. My first thought was CCT. I idled out of the alley and when u got to the street and gave it some gas the racket was enough to make me pull back into the garage and call the wife to come pick me up and take me to work. I didn't have a lot of time to mess with it but it sounded deeper in the engine than just the CCT I would imagine.
 
However now I'm thinking maybe burnt valve. Last week I noticed an odd smell about the exhaust and I strangely only got 134 miles out of a full tank of gas. Normally I'm up around 180 miles or so. But I just chalked it up possibly getting a bad tank of gas. There was no difference in performance or feel or sound last week.
 
The bike is a stock 2015 FJ-09 and has not had the CCT replaced.

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Post a video/sound clip if able... but if you are concerned about it being a valve issue, maybe not a good idea to run it.

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I dropped it off at the dealer just before that closed today. I hope to hear something tomorrow.
 
The bike is my only made of transport so I'm on a bicycle until it's back on the road.
 
Remnants of a hurricane supposed to roll through tomorrow. I'm really looking forward to that ?
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I think the dealer is trying to screw me.
 
Called and said it wouldn't start and they need another $98 to pull the valve cover and do a compression test. Apparently the first $98 only covered them hitting the starter button.
 
I'm half tempted to go get it and throw an APE manual CCT at it and see what happens. And apparently pay the $98 for them to get the starter button.
 

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I think that was just my anger at the situation talking. $200 may be a perfectly reasonable amount to do a compression check and pull the valve cover, I don't know. It's irrelevant at this point because I simply can't afford to have it done. I was just hoping that it was going to be the CCT and an easy repair. Doesn't look like that's going to be the case.
 
I can't afford to pay the dealer to fix it. I'm going to bring it home and tear into it.
 
Anybody know the cheapest place to find an FSM?

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I think that was just my anger at the situation talking. $200 may be a perfectly reasonable amount to do a compression check and pull the valve cover, I don't know. It's irrelevant at this point because I simply can't afford to have it done. I was just hoping that it was going to be the CCT and an easy repair. Doesn't look like that's going to be the case.  
I can't afford to pay the dealer to fix it. I'm going to bring it home and tear into it.
 
Anybody know the cheapest place to find an FSM?
Of all places I got mine a few weeks ago from Walmart Online for $35 and arrived within a week. If you are savvy enough you can find one online. I have found many Yamaha service manuals online. I don’t feel bad (copyright wise) because I did purchase the one for the bike I own. Adding a slipper clutch in the next few days and I found a 2016 SXR850 manual online and I downloaded it because needed to help install. So they do exists. 

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I think that was just my anger at the situation talking. $200 may be a perfectly reasonable amount to do a compression check and pull the valve cover, I don't know. It's irrelevant at this point because I simply can't afford to have it done. I was just hoping that it was going to be the CCT and an easy repair. Doesn't look like that's going to be the case.  
I can't afford to pay the dealer to fix it. I'm going to bring it home and tear into it.
 
Anybody know the cheapest place to find an FSM?
 
How many miles are on your FJ?

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How many miles are on your FJ?
Duhs10 is on to something; long distance diagnostics are difficult at best and without knowing history (other problems), mileage, maintenance, how easy/hard the bike has been ridden, diagnosing is impossible.
 
If you retrieve your bike from the dealer and get it running, make an audio recording (phone video is fine) and post it here. You can use a mechanics stethoscope ($5 at Harbor Freight)  or even a length of hose (one end in your ear, the other placed on the engine) to locate the origin of the sound/noise.   If possible, record the engine noise with one end of the hose on the engine and the other covering the phone's microphone.  If not, do the recording away from wind or running fans - moving air over a microphone screws things up. Start the engine and begin recording about 5 feet away from the engine. Bring the recorder up to the engine (within inches), near the origin of the noise.
 
For a "worst case" cost perspective, a quick check of eBay found two FJ-09 engines priced at $2000.  One, eBay item 362310979908, is said to have 428 miles on it, and includes shipping in the price. At $98/hour, it will take a dealer mechanic 20.4 hours to hit that amount (more with parts). Of course, it will take a home mechanic 20 hours or more to change an FJ-09 engine.

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I'd guess the mileage is around 10Kish. I'll let you know when I go pick it up after work this evening.
 
I'm the original owner. I've done all the maintenance according to the book, with the exception of synching the TBs. I changed the plugs earlier this spring. 99% of the miles have been commuting 30 miles round trip on 60mph roads. With a few weekend day trips thrown in. I don't run it hard until it comes up to Temp but I don't baby it once it's there. It's seen plenty of time at the speed limiter. It's completely stock engine and chassis wise.
 
If the repair is anywhere close to 2K the bike will sit until it's paid off then sold for whatever it'll bring. That money is simply not there and I don't foresee anything drastically changing in the immediate future.
 
I'll keep the updates coming once I get it home and start diagnosing it.
 
 

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Good info  Nicksta43.  Just speculation at this point, but for starters there's a possibility that the replacement spark plugs were not tightened sufficiently, one might have loosened up over time -- allowing excess air into the cylinder and a lean condition to occur. The ECU would try to compensate by increasing fuel (accounting for poor MPG on your last tank).  A lean air/fuel mix will increase combustion chamber temperature, and if the ECU fuel increase was not successful, could have burned valves or, unlikely but possible, even burned a hole in the piston. That cylinder would have either very low or no compression. 
 
When checking for that, the first indicator would be a loose spark plug when removing it (not even finger tight).  Second indicator would be a white insulator on the loose plug and probably, black insulators on the other plugs. "Proof" will be low or no compression reading on the cylinder with the loose plug. 
 
If that's what happened, a compression test is going to be essential. If you have the dealer do it, speak to the mechanic before the test and ask him to look for a loose spark plug when he does the test (same if you do it). That's only necessary for helping to determine the cause.  Having a general diagnosis of the problem will allow you to offer the bike for sale as a project, maybe before you pay it off completely. 
 
One point about dealership diagnosis: the cost of each stage is separate. That is, the cost of a compression test does not include reassembly of the parts. If you take the bike back when they give you the results of the test, you will get your motorcycle and a box of parts they removed to get access to the spark plugs. If you do the test yourself and find a low cylinder, the dealer can give you an estimate for a valve job which will help set a price for selling it.
 
Again, this is only speculating using what info you've provided so far and may be completely off the mark. You might discuss my speculation with the service manager or mechanic - they know more about CP3 engines than me. In any case, keep looking into it and keep posting what you find. 
 
  

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Hi @nicksta43 - That really sucks... can’t imagine something serious letting go in that low mileage of a bike, especially one that hasn’t been abused.
 
If you widen the search to used FZ09 motors, the prices come down significantly. Around $1,000 seems to be the going rate...
2016 Yamaha FZ-09 Motorcycle Engine Used, 2300 Miles, Complete https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F263996739179
 
Hopefully it won’t come to that, but it could be a viable option if necessary.

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Good info  Nicksta43.  Just speculation at this point, but for starters there's a possibility that the replacement spark plugs were not tightened sufficiently, one might have loosened up over time -- allowing excess air into the cylinder and a lean condition to occur. The ECU would try to compensate by increasing fuel (accounting for poor MPG on your last tank).  A lean air/fuel mix will increase combustion chamber temperature, and if the ECU fuel increase was not successful, could have burned valves or, unlikely but possible, even burned a hole in the piston. That cylinder would have either very low or no compression.  
When checking for that, the first indicator would be a loose spark plug when removing it (not even finger tight).  Second indicator would be a white insulator on the loose plug and probably, black insulators on the other plugs. "Proof" will be low or no compression reading on the cylinder with the loose plug. 
 
If that's what happened, a compression test is going to be essential. If you have the dealer do it, speak to the mechanic before the test and ask him to look for a loose spark plug when he does the test (same if you do it). That's only necessary for helping to determine the cause.  Having a general diagnosis of the problem will allow you to offer the bike for sale as a project, maybe before you pay it off completely. 
 
One point about dealership diagnosis: the cost of each stage is separate. That is, the cost of a compression test does not include reassembly of the parts. If you take the bike back when they give you the results of the test, you will get your motorcycle and a box of parts they removed to get access to the spark plugs. If you do the test yourself and find a low cylinder, the dealer can give you an estimate for a valve job which will help set a price for selling it.
 
Again, this is only speculating using what info you've provided so far and may be completely off the mark. You might discuss my speculation with the service manager or mechanic - they know more about CP3 engines than me. In any case, keep looking into it and keep posting what you find. 
 
  
 
 
This is good info and a good place to start. I'll definitely be doing any further diagnosis and repairs. A compression check is the first thing in my list, well after cleaning the garage out so I have a place to work. It's possible that a plug backed out but there was no change whatsoever in the power, the idle quality or the sound last week. But it's certainly a possibility.
 
Thanks.

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